Friday, January 13, 2006

Peugeot 207





Just a few more pictures of this new small car.
It is about the size of the new Yaris, and about the same price in Europe.

I think it is much more modern and upscale than the Toyota.
And Peugeot is planning on selling around 500 000 of these in the year 2007.

That is more than Camrys in the US!

23 comments:

Anonymous said...

Not to bash on you, but you seriously do not know what you are talking about a lot of the time... Whenever you post on these shitty little European econo-boxes that COULD never and WOULD never sell in the US, you say that you think they look "upscale" and "modern" when in reality, they look outdated before they even come out, and to be made of bargain-bin materials. Have you ever been in these cars? They are horrible!

Another thing you fail to point out is that these cars have the driving dynamics of a 1950s tractor, to say the least. Can you imagine trying to drive a 70 horsepower diesel minicar with 13" rims on a California highway? I thought not.

A Kia Rio's quality is much better than any of these French cars. That's why the Rio and the rest of the Kia line are so popular in Europe, and moving more and more popular. The Yaris, also, I'm sure is of INFINITELY higher quality than anything Peugeot, Renault, or Citroen have to offer in their entire lineups. I'm not talking about feature/content, I'm talking of solely these Yarises quality. Toyota just plain will not sell crap like this anymore. The Scion xB is not even high enough quality to wear a Toyota badge to the US market...

Go drive one of these cars. They are what we like to call throw-away cars, because they are to a real car, what a throw-away camera is to a real camera. Yes, they can park just fine. Drive good? Not so. Look good? Maybe on LSD. Hold up? Definitely not.

Anonymous said...

Looks like a Ka.

Anonymous said...

Dear anonymous...
I happen to have lived in the US and in Europe. I currently live in the UK due to work, my wife has a 2006 Renault Clio, and I currently drive a Vauxhall (Opel) Astra VXR.

You're talking absolute crap!

The renault and Vauxhall both handle superbly, (at least twice as well as any American car i've ever owned). The dynamics are brilliant, i really think the likes of Chevy could learn a hell of a lot from its European sister manufacturer.

As far as "bargain- bin materials" go, Ford didnt give America the 2005 Focus because it was too expensive to produce due to the high quality the European market expects. I'd even go as far as saying the interior is of a better quality than ANY of Ford US's current car line up.

My "econobox" has a 240BHP engine and is faster than a golf GTI, on top of that it is more modern looking than virtually any car you can buy in America. (exception = BMWs). MY wifes econobox has over 100bhp, and is probably faster than most American cars, because it doesnt weigh 14 tonnes. And for that reason it also goes round corners like a go-kart.

As far as the Rio goes its a hideous peice of **@*!

Well done on ur blog Vince, keep up the good work, i completely agree with most of what you say!

Vince Burlapp said...

I have been in quite a few European cars. Not the all new 207 yet.
But other Peugeots, Renaults, Opels and Fords.
Even with the diesels they do just fines.
And that is where people actually drive much faster than on a "California Highway" where you feel like driving a sports car when you hit 80.
I drove a Megane in europe at 90mph on the freeway and almost everyone was passing me!

The quality on the interiors are so much better than just a few years ago.
It's like comparing a new Hyundai to what they were putting out 10 years ago.

As for 13 inch rims, that has nothing to do with being able to drive on the freeway. Where does that one come from???

The Rio is nothing great. And Kia is still a very minor player in Europe. Their image is crap. Their designs to clumbsy for European tastes.

These "throw away cars"do hold up. Some of my European friends have had their cars for well over 15 years. And that includes the much roughter "European driving" manners.

But I have to say, it is fun to read crappy comments that don't make any sense from someone who might actually not be old enough to drive...

My suggestions are:

-Wait till you're old enought to drive
-Travel
-Get a girlfriend

On second thought, get the girlfriend first.
(Internet chat doesn't count)

Anonymous said...

Shock the monkey

Anonymous said...

Well done Vince!!

Anonymous said...

Go Vince!

Anonymous said...

I'm sure in their next foray into N Amereca, whenever that is, if ever, Peugeot will stupidly import only their top-line cars, 607's & such, all automatiques with leather and costing 30 grand plus. And they'll again fall on their face because they weren't smart enough to bring over the 207, 307 and the 407 (SW!). Not to mention setting up a proper and quality dealer network....

Anonymous said...

hey i live in california, and i drive a 1990 toyota tercel, 13 inch rims, 87 hp, more like 70 hp at the drive wheels, and that car does 80 mph all day long, rides excellent and gets 35 mpg.

Anonymous said...

That Peugeot has such a big-mouthed look as if it wants to give head!

Anonymous said...

unlike the first person's comment, when i learn to drive, i would much rather be having a modern and compact car that doesnt give me more than i need. that being said, i don't really have much of a choice over here. the civic is too pricey, the corolla is too boring, the 3 is "too expensive to insure", and the new jetta is just too expensive. and smaller cars like the yaris and fit arent even available yet! so i think peugeot would be perfect for young drivers like me wanting great fuel economy, styling, and safety. so the performance isn't great, but what 16-year-old needs it! (and yes, i have a girlfriend)

Anonymous said...

Howcome we can drive twice faster with two times less power than you Americans?? I think it's just because power is CHEAP where you at. What do you say?

Regards,
Martin from Europe

Anonymous said...

While I think that the first post was kind of stupid, I think that he was right to a large degree. These European cars are not as refined as people would like to think they are.

I'm Swiss, but I live in the states... I'm going to have to side with the fact that these cars are probably behind US cars. Mind you, the Open Astra is the same car as a Chevrolet Cobalt, but I bet that if anyone of you drove both you'd just say that the Chevrolet is worse because of the stigma attached.

Also, statistically, one can see that Hyundai/Kia cars are actually of higher quality, and higher longevity (also, increasingly) than the majority of French cars. Additionally, I'd like to point out that the 'hottest' car in Germany the last two years was the Kia Sorento, and there was a waiting list for it. Their popularity is building so much that they are coming out with Europe-exclusive models, as well as launching a new European design facility.

http://www.dexigner.com/architecture/news-g4961.html

...and Kia's reputation is crap? I think that you are comparing it to what is perhaps the only car with a worse reputation.

TheTrashReactor said...

its great, the pictures say

"Buy the Peugeot 207 and get HOT FRENCH CHICKS!"

It looks good, but how well is it put together?

Anonymous said...

Having driven probably 100,000+ miles in the US, UK and Europe, here's my penny's worth.....

The people in our two continents have such different driving styles that the cars are therefore designed with different dynamics, and therefore I don't think you can compare. FACT: the suspension configuration for models like the 3-Series and Lexus IS are different in Europe and USA; softer in the US to compensate for the rougher terrain and straighter roads, tighter in Europe to allow for more active handling around corners.

In the US, the highways are predominantly of concrete and aren't as smooth but they're straight and a lot wider. Petrol (gas) is also considerably cheaper. Result: cars are bigger, less fuel efficient but DEFINITELY smoother. The driving culture is to float on roads, to take in the bumps, to relax and enjoy the journey.

In Europe, roads are of a much higher quality - a rubber-rich tarmac compound is used that is much flatter to drive on. Roads are twisty but narrow. Petrol is expensive. So vehicles like the Peugeot 207 sell well, which have smaller engines but are so much lighter, they probably have a similar power/weight ratio. The driving culture is much more involved, actively taking corners, driving at 80-100mph on even twisty highways.

As for car interiors, my experience is that Japanese and German manufacturers are the best (my personal favourite is Lexus). Then follows other European manufacturers such as Peugeot, Citroen, Renault, Fiat. I think some US manufacturers produce quite delightful, quality interiors such as Cadillac and Lincoln. But then you have the likes of Ford and GMC that use cheaper plastics with big panel gaps.

Let the debate continue.......!

(Vince - I still think this is the world's greatest car spyshots website. Great job, thank you)

Anonymous said...

The Cobalt is built on the previous Astra platform, which is no longer built in Europe.

French are made from good materials and superbly engineered, but they still have a lot of electrical problems. I guess it's because of the phlegmatic nature of the French people.

Germans cars are well engineered and well made, but more and more from perfect. And they're dull just as their manufacturers are, the Germans.

Japanese are very well put together, very well engineered, but have no character.

I've driven all three, a nissan, many Citroens, some VW's, Opels and some more. I've had most pleasure with the Citroën. Not perfectly put together, but offers great ride and handling, good overall quality, great interior room and good economy at a reasonable price. But I would still take a toyota for a trip around the world. That's my opinion.

Martin from Europe

Anonymous said...

I've just driven from London Sheffield in my 1.0L Vauxhall Corsa, which has like 60BHP, i was doing 100mph for most of it. It was perfectly refined and i arrived there really comfy. :-)

Anonymous said...

It's factually incorrect that the Opel Astra is not on the same platform as the current Chevrolet Cobalt. It is. You can go and look at their website...It even has the same doors!

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Anonymous said...

First of all, thank you vince for your well made blog! ;)

I live in South-Germany and I am a lucky owner of a Peugeot 207 HDi 110HP (diesel) since July 2006.
You certainly know that many parts of our highways have no limitation. I use to drive 120mph every morning to go to work (like many other drivers here), and the rest about 60mph on our mountains.
The driving is superb, the 1.6 16V diesel engine uses 40 mpg, which is correct here in Europe, with this style of driving. The grip into curves is wonderful (it has 17" rims, not 13" like some people think).

About the interior quality, well it approaches the german standards, which is not bad at all. Very modern, many functionalities, on board computer, etc...
About the electrical problems, nothing to say. Peugeot cars (like many others) are multiplexed with CAN bus, and is very robust.

About the agressive style: I love it!!! Much better than all those boring VW is see everyday on our streets.

About US cars. I drived only a 2002 Pontiac Sunfire during about 2000 miles in Canada, and a Ford Taurus. During this period I dreamt about my Peugeot 306 HDi I've had during this period. Much better agility, less noise, less consuption and more power (2.0 turbo diesel HDi engine) for the Peugeot...
Those two US cars had crappy interiors (the plastic quality of the european Ford Focus is much better!).

European and american tastes for cars (driving, design, use...) are a bit different.
I agree with HJ from London too! ;)

Today, the Peugeot 207 is the most sold car in Europe in its class!

Bye bye!
HarikenRed, from Germany

Anonymous said...

Came across your discussion, and I just had to chime in:

I am an american, male, about 40yoa, and last summer I travelled to Scotland and rented a Pgt 207 1.4l HDi for about three weeks. We gave that little bastard quite a workout: me, wife, and young son, boot full of luggage. Variety of road types and conditions: single track, 4-lane highway, country, city, day, night, wet, dry, etc etc.

This is a well designed little car, with excellent handling and good power (we had the manual version). Anyone who poo-poos this car based merely on Pgt's reputation needs to look again. Anonymous is an idiot, but I think everyone else around here already figured that out.

If they bother to import this car to the US at a reasonable price, it'll sell very well after an initial slack period as people get used to it.

Ultimately, given my experience getting 50-55mpg, I have been wondering why more turbodiesels aren't available in the US? Something to do with environmental controls I am sure, but you can't argue with mileage that good.

Start beating the drum now if you can: tell everyone and anyone who cares, bring cars like this to the US, either imported or domestically manufatured, doesn't matter.

Anonymous said...

I'd love to be able to buy a Peugeot in the US. My wife's from Chile and I'm so jealous that they don't sell them here. (They're everywhere down there) There IS a market here for upscale compact cars (MINIs are selling like hot cakes). I'm probably going to end up buying a MINI, but I'd rather have a 207. =(.

Can't believe that no one sells a fuel efficient compact car here. The only turbo diesels you can get here are in VWs that cost 20K plus. Anyone worried about mileage here isn't going to spend that much on a car. To make up the price difference between the cost of a Yaris (U$11,000) that gets 40mpg, and a Prius(U$23,000) that gets 51mpg, you would have to drive the car for more than 80 years! (assuming you drive about 10k mi/yr and gas were always $3/gallon. You could cut that to 20yrs if you were to drive 20k mi/yr and gas went up to $6/gal. Few drive that much however and gas will never reach $6/gal anytime in the near future (considering we're paying $2/gal now).

In general, something like a fuel efficient peugeot 207 diesel makes more sense; something that's economical to buy and to drive. (and looks darn good too). There aren't really any super fuel efficient vehicles here that would make sense to buy. Their higher cost of purchase will likely never be countered by their fuel efficiency. Civics and Corollas come closest if you ask me, but neither of them have anywhere near the style of a Peugeot! Hybrids certainly aren't a good option (unless you're buying it to save the environment)

Peugeots do have a bad reputation in the US from when they actually sold them here, and even now most of their cars are horribly unreliable. (we don't need to import unreliable cars, we already make them here!) Their compacts are actually the exception. Statistics say that it should be a reliable car, though you're just asking for trouble if you buy a sedan or something larger from Peugeot.

Anyone know how I could import a 207?